Episode Transcript
Speaker 1 00:01:23 Hello. Welcome back. This is <inaudible> from Somali link radio at K F a I 90.3 FM community radio on every hour is a different program. Um, so if you want to listen to KFI radio, you can listen to the radio from around the world, anywhere in the world. All you have to do is click on K F a i.org. And every hour you will find different language or different program or different types of music or news. Today, we have a wonderful program for you as usual. And, um, I've got four wonderful ladies who have been doing a trauma research in the community, and that is Dr. <inaudible> professor of, of the school in social work and, uh, on the mentor of the other guests, uh, for the past summer. Uh, the other guest is our Sophia Ali sophomore at the university of Minnesota, twin cities studying sociology, Sophia Muhammad, another Sophia, a sophomore at St. Thomas studying journalism. And of course the senior Amad, every student graduate with a degree in biology with their professor, Dr. Saida Abdi. And today we are going to talk about, um, mental health, specifically trauma, and, um, this young ladies and their professor has been doing research on trauma and the multiple layers it has, uh, in relation to that, to our community. So, hello, welcome. And, uh, everybody welcome.
Speaker 2 00:03:16 Thank you so much for having us instead of being here. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 00:03:24 Thank you. Thank you. Um, let me start with Eden. Sorry. The, how are you?
Speaker 2 00:03:31 I am doing well. How are you Zach?
Speaker 1 00:03:34 Good professors that you, the last time I saw you, you were doing a research and that you were back and forth between Boston, Massachusetts and the twin cities.
Speaker 2 00:03:45 Yes. I wanted to try in my community here. So I'm here now. I moved. Thank you. Um, so Molly SunTrust, you know,
Speaker 3 00:03:56 It's, it's, it's
Speaker 1 00:03:57 Really amazing to have all of you, especially at this time, uh, this time we're, um, uh, we are, we're seeing, um, mental health, um, has been there in our, in every community. And, uh, the stigma is also not limited to our smiley or east African community, but in every community, but, um, the bandaid, because as you all know, I believe made it worse, especially for young people. Um, and you can see that everywhere in our communities, I am so happy that you have spent so much time all of you together, uh, researching the trauma and how it impacts our young people in our community. Tell me about the research cider.
Speaker 2 00:04:40 Um, as you know, I have spent many years now thinking about teaching about, and also, uh, writing about trauma, but also, you know, resiliency, what are things that are in our copper, in our community that are helpful to ask to deal as well as what are the things that, uh, are contribute to trauma? And how do we, you know, for a long time thinking about trauma is, you know, either a clinician or an academic or a people who's, uh, you know, it's your chops. And I think, um, in the last year and I moved to here and I was, as you said, I'm at the university. And I am meeting these amazing young Somalis who are all interested in learning about and understanding trauma, but more importantly, learning about how they can become part of the healing in our community, how they can promote healing.
Speaker 2 00:05:39 And so when an idea came to me, you know, why can't we have a group of somebodies looking at trauma are thinking Somali youth, uh, young people, um, you see three here, but there are more. And I was very blessed. I, I think that our community is still reach in our youths and I am, I feel very blessed to be here in Minnesota and to be working with these young people. I was able to secure a very, a small grant, um, from youth price with a specific idea of we are going to have a youth working with me, uh, and thinking about not just trauma, but our culture, our own healing, but indigenous practices. We have such a richness in our culture. I always say that trauma happened to us back home too, but we have healing practices that helped us. And now, you know, our people are seeing the stigma.
Speaker 2 00:06:34 We're not used to wearing their therapist. So how can we bridge that gap? And then, you know, like we spent, we spent the youth and I spent, uh, this year, cause, you know, COVID of course changed everything, including, uh, making, you know, trauma much more relevant and much more precedent. I mean the last year has been traumatic for many of our community members. And so actually the issue of trauma is not just about the war. It's not just about the fact that we, our community, you know, uh, has experienced a lot of traumatic events since coming here, but it is also what we have lost in the past year. And I am actually going to allow the youth to talk about what they did and the work. Uh, but I am just grateful to have this opportunity to introduce, and also to be partnering with Somali, young Somalian people in this work. And they will be the future of our healers and, and understanding our research, our healing, they will be the ones who lead us into the future. Thank you.
Speaker 1 00:07:35 Thank you, Jacob. I really thank you very much for engaging our young, um, students who are learning about sociology and biology and who are going to lead us in the near future and, uh, also be out of service providers. And, um, that is something that, that, that usually don't happen where our, um, researchers on professors like you connect with our young people and kind of Todd, you know, hunting down the button. Uh, so let me start talking to Sophia, Sophia, tell me about your experience working with the group and other professors. <inaudible> doing research on trauma.
Speaker 4 00:08:22 Um, I can, yeah, I can, um, go first. I, if there is one takeaway from our work, it is to look at everything within context, within cultural context, within, um, the context of everything that everyone's experience, um, because, and so, uh, when defining what trauma is and seeing how it is a normal response of the body to a situation that is not normal, um, what is reacting to danger that is experienced in the past? It's just that the trigger is something, um, normal that should not have that response. And so looking at everything within context and understanding that there are no, no two people experienced trauma in the same way and the trauma is never ever your fault. And, um, just switching something that helps to say the role is say's to switch on lens on trauma from asking what is wrong with the youth to what's the child's perception of what has happened or is happening to them. So that is one big takeaway from me from everything that we've done.
Speaker 1 00:09:35 Thank you. Uh, now let me move on to Sofia Mohammed. What was Sophia? What was your experience of working, um, on a research, uh, with a team led by the professor saying them on trauma in a culturally appropriate way.
Speaker 5 00:09:56 It was an amazing experience. I learned so much, um, Dr. Seva, I hadn't prior to this research, I knew about the, um, collective trauma that the Somali community has and the ways in which, uh, the refugee experience has really impacted them. However, I've never really sat down with the next birds or with, uh, other youth and really delved into it. So this was an opportunity for me to talk to people who are a part of my community and people who share similar stories and were able to create a safe space to not only learn about our, the collective trauma of our community, but also to learn about our, to talk about our own experiences and learn from each other.
Speaker 1 00:10:45 Thank you, Sophia Mohammed. And now let's move on saying Ahmed saying, what was the experience? Oh, there's the fear that was saying it, right?
Speaker 4 00:10:58 No, that was the field. I'm Sophia. The Dana was first.
Speaker 1 00:11:01 Okay. Where is, um, okay. Sophia let's, um, uh, ask you, um, used to feel it right. So, first of all, I want to thank you from making all the connection to really make this important program happen. Thank you very much for all your work. Uh, the same question for you, Sophia, um, as a youngest student, uh, as a female students working with other students, um, under the guidance of professors, uh, Cena, what was the experience doing this research on trauma, um, in our community?
Speaker 4 00:11:42 Yeah, so it was professor he though, sorry, but I just want to say that I agree with everything Zane and Sophia said, and working under for the city that I'm working with, you know, the other youth who most a part of the research was so amazing and it was super nice to be able to, you know, have the master students, you know, present us with so much information about trauma and give us, you know, like the scientific aspect of it. And being able to, you know, have conversations because a lot of us are from the same community. So being able to have conversations about our community and our culture and the way that, and our personal experience, like Sophia said, it was really nice to just like, be in a space where everyone understood you and everyone has, you know, kind of the same understanding. And yeah, it was, it was, it was amazing.
Speaker 1 00:12:29 Uh, thank you all. Now let's go to the research. Uh, let me go back to Dr. <inaudible>, uh, saying, um, I'm sorry to, I say the Abdi, um, say that, tell me the, how long this, uh, research took place. How did you do it where you, um, combined it to just one city of Minneapolis, the community here, or you working with the communities in Boston and mounted twin cities. Tell me about the framework of this work.
Speaker 2 00:13:03 Um, I, him, no, thank you so much. And again, I agree with everyone, first of all, you know, I'm sitting here sort of being, oh, these young people. I really, as I said before, feel absolutely blessed. I feel amazing really, um, you know, lucky that I got sent to work with them, um, they led me and I want to say this, you know, when we started, uh, before COVID, that's, when we're supposed to start, the plan was that we'd go out and do a lot of research data collection. And so on it turns out, of course it was cool with the week for my golf is meant to be put into the work. So what we ended up is actually doing more, looking into the different items of, uh, of research that was halted available through my work, because I've done it. It's your job.
Speaker 2 00:13:49 As you know, before and looking at how we think about trauma, would I say never every Wednesday and I'm Sophia and Sophia said are looking at the context of the culture and the community. For example, one thing we discussed was the idea that, uh, you know, Somali, cultural values, like, uh, things like that hill had her Schmoe, HIG are parts of all of our ways of healing. I said, community they're part of the things we have to integrate it into the research and the work we do here with our youth. And for me, it was as much a learning for myself. And as I think it was a fear who said this, but we also had two massive seven students who were working with us, um, and, and high school, and actually, uh, but it was, it was really looking at the data and the work and, and, and the frameworks we already had and sort of developing from there what these young people felt was, was appropriate at for them in some ways, I mean, this whole project is really about pre-thinking trauma thinking traumatic the way we approached trauma and really talking specifically when we work with young people, because young people have a different response to the problem, they have a different understanding.
Speaker 2 00:15:11 They have a different experiences, uh, you know, in Somali culture. Historically, we always think about the trauma has the worst trauma, but as you know, many of our young people that are raised in the streets of Minneapolis, there is a racial trauma that we have to think about, uh, that may be those of us who are older don't experience in similar way. And so the work was really so unpacking what I have known in my history and my work, and then this young people bringing a different lens to it. And I want to let them do then talk about <inaudible> specifically about healing.
Speaker 1 00:15:47 Um, so let's say, um, I want to ask you when we come back by listening to this message, I want to ask you, you mentioned one important thing that we always talk about intergenerational gap. Um, the young people who were grew up here who were born here and the first generation or second generation that came here and, um, the cultural gap between them, the language barrier between them. And, um, most of all of the cultural gap that really sometimes creates its own trauma. So I want to ask you about that. Um, if that's included in this study, after we hear this message, thank you very much for being patient. Um, doctor say, um, again, my question is, um, in, this is tidy of trauma in our, that relates to our community that are yet three young, uh, students are working with you. You mentioned that there's the racial trauma. There are other traumas specific to the young people than the first generation or second generation who came here and not necessarily feel that trauma. And you talked about the, what we call trauma related to war or civil war or fleeing or leaving the land with dire conditions of other refugee camps or so the intergenerational gap trauma. Tell me more about that.
Speaker 2 00:17:23 Well, I see, you know, you know, uh, Tama is, as I think beautifully, uh, the young Sophia and Sophia, Zayna articulated this about things that happened to us. It's not about who we are. It's not going to be it's experiences. We had that leave something behind sometimes. And so, uh, I said community that comes from war. Of course, those of us who are older, we came from a lot of trauma. We left behind our Ontario homes and so on. But when we got here and we have children here, uh, we, we do remember what we have gone through, but it is very hard for us to understand what our children are going through because that's not our experience. You know, I was raised in the show. I, I, my identity is really grounded in that. And so our expectations, our children will be exactly, uh, we'll have that same experience and those same identities and beliefs, but reality is our children are sort of struggling, um, different cultures.
Speaker 2 00:18:20 They are often naturally in my research, they will tell you, I am Somali. That's my heart, but I'm also African-American because when I step out of my door, that is who everyone is. That's who the polices, they will see somebody in a sense, even though in Minnesota, they might, but often they are Muslim. They are Somali. They are African-American they. And most of our, what we call intersection now, identities that are often marginalized and often identities that carry pain. And so it is very hard for us as Somali woman, who has never had to go through those things to understand what your daughter with her child in this school being in college is smart. The doctor we succeeding, but the experiences of pain and oppression and discrimination that young girl experiences is very hard for us to understand that really with this project, with these young people, I'm working with what we're trying to do is in our conversation between them and I, and then conversations, hopefully they will have in the community.
Speaker 2 00:19:26 It is to try and bring it to create narratives that value the patterns and experience, but also value that the youth is experience is different. And in some ways we, as patterns is as Somalis, as Somali adults have to, in order to promote the resilience and success of our children, we have to understand their experiences, which is, and we have to be able to talk to them if a young orphan, you know, young woman, um, who, as I said, wears hijab and who may experience discrimination in this because she's wearing her job. But if she were to talk of that child, then she will feel pain in her community. And so that is really a struggling that older community members may not have never had experience without each other. That's always been what we do, you know what we were. So those are here and also how we speak to each other and what we speak about how we are raising our children. I, you know, this is real, the intergenerational discourse and the inter intergenerational understanding. It's not just about the youth. It's also about teaching our children. And like I said, our traditional values or cultural addition is Bradley as well. And I think that once Sophia and any one of you to speak about, because I know that, that we wanted to talk about healing, we just don't us to start about negative. We want to talk about the positive in the work that we did. So Sophia, do you want to share?
Speaker 5 00:20:57 Yes. So like how to say the said, in addition to talking about the different, um, factors that go into trauma, as well as the symptoms and, um, how it is manifested and how it continues. We do talk about the, um, the work that goes into addressing it and the communal responses, the good that is coming out of addressing trauma. So one thing that we covered was restorative practices, which is a form of healing form of communal healing. And, um, restorative practices is something that is rooted in a lot of indigenous cultures. And what I personally did not know is that it is a practice that is rooted in Somali culture as well, where if there's a problem within a community, people will come together to address it. If there are disputes, people will come together to try to solve whatever issues. Two people are having two or more people are having. And it's one of the, um, one of the more positive things that we talked about, um, amongst our groups and positive in the sense that it shows that people are paying attention and that there are, um, there are initiatives and, um, just things that go into addressing trauma.
Speaker 1 00:22:22 Thank you. I'm Sophia.
Speaker 4 00:22:26 Yeah, I also, yeah, I agree with what Sophia said and that like restorative practices are very specific. There are restorative practices specific to our community and that people, you know, can move towards healing by practicing those things. But I also want to, um, add on to like what you asked, how to say that about like the generational gap. I think that a lot of the work that we're doing kind of moves to like, like bridge that gap and that, like, I obviously, you know, the trauma that our parents experienced and the trauma that, you know, youth in this country experience aren't the same, but to their cores, a lot of people want is just to feel understood. And so if we have, you know, the conversation that we were having with publicity, that we would talk every sing on every week on zoom and so on, we would have conversations about our experiences, you know, hubs either. And, um, another, was it a Nissa who worked with us and other women who worked with us would talk about their experiences. And even though they weren't relatable to us, just, you know, like understanding that people's experiences are different and, um, was just super helpful. And so, you know, having conversations about trauma is also like really beneficial when it comes to healing.
Speaker 1 00:23:29 Thank you, Sophia. Uh, you guys are great. Um, now let me give the mic to, um, say Batman.
Speaker 4 00:23:41 Yeah. I absolutely agree with everything that <inaudible> said. Um, so one thing that stood out for me when we were talking about radical healing, as well as, as Sophie, I'm sure we can agree on, we were talking about when you were talking about how, um, <inaudible> created those spaces is that those places were, um, not only safe, but we were decentralizing our own idea of Western medicine or, um, Western ways of healing. So where instead of that, we would replace cultural ideologies, um, that I talked about before. And for me, that was the most important thing, because while we were talking and while we were researching trauma, we were not further traumatizing ourselves within, um, Western spaces, especially within academia. Um, so for me, yeah, so for me, that was the most important piece. Um, yeah.
Speaker 1 00:24:44 Yeah. Thank you. Um, say that, uh, um, doctor say that now I would love to talk about the trauma and, um, for the, for our audiences, tell us general, um, description of what trauma is, if it's the same as the, any trauma or this specific trauma in our community.
Speaker 2 00:25:09 Thank you so much. And again, you know, I, I applied, I said, I'm Healy blessed to be working with these young people and their amazing thinking and articulation of, um, we need more spaces like this, uh, safe spaces for our youth and our community to come together and take what science has given us, but then bring our own cultural practices and our values and our ways of being in communicating and building from there. So trauma is really this simple home. If something that happens to you, it's not like I say, who you are. The example I always give is if someone is hit by a car, uh, you know, and they're lying in the street and they broke their leg, we don't go to them and say, get up, walk. You know, I don't complain, but that's shameful. You pick them up when we take them to the hospital and the left is hill, it's sad, but we know what it takes to help with that person, because we are, we have empathetic understanding of your pain, but when something hits our soul, what it hits our brain, what is our sense of cause trauma is something that overwhelms your sense of what the world is supposed to be.
Speaker 2 00:26:19 Right? Yeah. I'll give you an example of a person who one morning wakes up and the whole time where the lift is on fire and they have to run out with the clothes on their back. That's a traumatic event. Um, but in, in, in Minneapolis, a child, who's born in a neighborhood where there are the gun, you know, um, sort of the sound of gunfire every night, that's a traumatic event. And so it doesn't mean that every single person that, that happens, those events happen to is going to develop if trauma effect or somatic stress. It doesn't mean only certain person wanting to maybe develop it. But if I tell you the research we did with Somali youth that came like grew up here, actually, we don't see much difference between youth who were born here and the one that should work, because there's more trauma here.
Speaker 2 00:27:14 It's not the war. It could be with interaction with the police. It could be interaction, you know, in the school systems where there's a lot of violence. It could be because of the neighborhood providers, as he said, it could be because of violence in the community. So this is, this is what those painful moments like the car is in. You leave behind and now to heal you, you know, there are a lot of, uh, sort of scientific, it's actually something we can do something about. And the thing that pains me more than anything else in the world is watching people suffer when we actually can help, is watching people suffered because they cannot sleep at night because they can't eat because they have nightmares because they don't feel safe in the world. Because what trauma does is it takes away your sense of safety in the world. You do not feel safe in the world.
Speaker 1 00:28:08 Yeah. Thank you very much for really breaking down what the trauma is. Um, but tell us how do people know that they have a trauma because in our culture, um, you know, because what we went through after the civil war was supposed to do to toughen up, we were supposed to happen. Don't talk about emotions. We were supposed to, you know, um, lick our wounds and move, move on, limp on, you know, until we heal. Uh, we never talk about this other as an adults in the community, the first generation. So what are the symptoms of the trauma,
Speaker 2 00:28:47 Your height? You know, this is really one of the saddest parts of our cultural community, both here and also back home is that we are a culture that was raised not to complain, not to cry. Uh, you know, sometimes people will say like, you know, if you had EMOM eman, so the He-Man like, uh, you wouldn't have this illness because you know what, like why otherwise this is what a lot is prescribed for you. This has to do with eman. It has to do with religion. I will tell you, like, this is like, just to, like I said, if someone was hit by a car, it's not because they're humanities is, you know, it's not good. It's the bus, a car hit them. Similar thing. What you can see is, you know, if you are not able to sleep, if you are having flashbacks, remembering those events as though they were happening again, if there are things that have been around you that remind you as I think Cena the one who said, he reminded you of that event, that then tell you back to that event.
Speaker 2 00:29:46 So that's what the triggering is about. Um, you know, for new children, if they are startling, they are, you know, if something like, even COVID is traumatic. So if children are, uh, we say it's, it's so traumatic, the way we, we sort of manifest trauma is both culturally. It can be culturally specific, so different cultures. So for example, in cultural, like Somali culture, where people, as you said, don't speak about their emotions. How often do you bowl internalizing that they are hiding that pain, even though it's there. Now it may be boys and girls. It may be gender. Um, you know, often I, as you know, I do a lot of work with schools and you will see that I will get a lot of referrals for boys, but not for girls because in the culture, there's more permission for boys to act out and girls may interhouse and still have all the pain, but no one is actually noticing.
Speaker 2 00:30:40 So it's culturally the way we manifest it may be different. It may be something in the body. Like when I talk to young people, I talk about how is your body? How was like, when you're thinking about that thing and how did your muscles feel? How does your stomach feel? How does your heart feel? Because sometimes that is the only way because we also in samadhi, don't have a lot of words for emotion. So if someone can describe to me how their body's feeling, and that's how I know that they're having some traumatic reaction. So it's also developmentally specific. So if a five-year old may start to, you know, if they were, if they were totally training, they may start bedwetting. They may start cling to the mother. So they may regress developmentally. So you, you know, you wanted to see if, if someone had an event.
Speaker 2 00:31:24 So we started with it. Was there an event that sort of overwhelmed test cause pain is scary that this young person, or this person experienced it, which as you said, middle class it's yes. Then you're looking at, you know, it's, it's that event coming back. Are you thinking about this? The person hypervigilance is scared watching for, are they having difficulty sleeping and concentrating? Are they eating? So, so if you have like a list of things you look at, but if you're concerned, even talking to your primary care, we don't necessarily have to take our children. The first day we worry about or ourselves to psychiatrists, even talking to your primary care doctor saying, you know, since that thing have been this way, they will know if you're having news more. I will also tell you something that can heal in Charlotte. I gave us the medication and gave us the turbine because that's both of them is available.
Speaker 2 00:32:21 Also you're patenting and you have a trauma reaction. There is the intergenerational trauma. You can actually hand it over to your child because your learn is how to live in the world, by looking at you. Yeah. If you're safe, if you're scared, if you're being bigger, if you can't asleep, if you th the child will fear of that pattern inside, do you know what a child falls down, who they look at the patterns, if they hadn't, and it doesn't mean parents are bad, they themselves need help. But if you, if anyone is feeling those things and thinking about situations that happen, that are coming back to them, if you seek help, it's not just for yourself, it's for your child. Sometimes we have whole families, cause trauma can be familiar. It actually can be community, a whole communities like ours can have trauma. And I want to go back to resilience. We are also the most resilient. Beautiful. I'm sorry if I'm taking a little time Sophia talking about the resilience, because we are very resilient to people. We are raising these beautiful young people, so it's not all trauma, but we can also heal as a community. Thank you. Thank you.
Speaker 1 00:33:32 Uh, Sophia, go ahead. What would you add? Well, go ahead.
Speaker 5 00:33:42 Yeah, I would just like to say that I agree with, uh, Hubble say that we are very resilient and, um, I think a lot of young Somali folks they've found ways to really move beyond the obstacles and the trauma that you've experienced and even carried it from their parents and by creating spaces for themselves there, they also invite other young Somali folks who have experienced similar, um, similar things to really join them in the work that they're doing and to create the solidarity that is aligned with our resilience,
Speaker 1 00:34:26 Sophia,
Speaker 4 00:34:29 Um, this isn't completely relatable. It is actually pretty related, but I wanted to talk about, um, like the stigmatization of like talking openly about your trauma in our community. I know that there's a lot of stigma around, you know, talking about mental health and talking about trauma. And I think that a lot of that comes from people like being upset that they didn't, they, they never got the opportunity to heal from their trauma. And so when people are openly healing, you know, they feel almost like resentment because they never got that. And so I want to emphasize that, you know, it's okay to talk openly about your trauma, even if it's something that other people in the community experience that you think shouldn't be traumatizing for you. Yeah. So it's like, it's important to just like, not let the stigma like get in your head and just seek help if that's what you think you need. Thank you. So
Speaker 2 00:35:18 That's such a beautiful after play. Thank you so much for bringing back that, um, in, within a family of four people, you can have the same exact trauma and it will impact each person different too, because it's just that, that's how it goes. Right? And so what's Sophie say is so important is that two sides did. One is that we, as a community have to understand, like I said, you don't shame people because they have cancer. You don't shame people because they, they broke their leg, Russian people because they have any kind of illness and, and having mental or mental illness and trauma in this case, traumatic stress is something that has happened to you that you are responsible for. So shaming people having to hide our parents, feeling ashamed, uh, you know, because a child is depressed. We need to still introduce that and talk about it openly, like, uh, these young conversing, but additionally, as community leaders, religious leaders, uh, providers, parents, this is who, uh, educational, um, educators. We need to openly talk about that. We live in a, in a, in a society where there's a lots from where we come from a side where there's a lot of trauma, uh, and we need to th the way to overcome trauma, it's not hided or tell me the impact of trauma on psychological wellbeing. It's not to hide it is to heal it. And so the more we hide it, the worse it gets, not the better it gets.
Speaker 1 00:36:43 Thank you. Um, say Matt, what's your take?
Speaker 4 00:36:50 Yeah, I absolutely agreed. Um, when, when we were talking about resilience earlier, I was thinking about, yes, we are very resilient and it is, um, our strength is very beautiful, but, um, hopefully we can get to a certain point in our healing journey to where we don't need to be resilient anymore, um, because it does get exhausting, uh, at some points. And, um, yeah, I, yeah, I just agree with everything that Sophia Sophia said,
Speaker 1 00:37:23 Thank you. Um, there's, uh, you know, working with the community and being sourceful for over the years, people call me and others like me, um, whatever access they need, uh, or issues they have, so we can help, um, directed them to the right resources. So sometimes Dr. Saying, um, uh, I got frightened and calls, uh, that really scared me about mental health and how some parents are not aware of it or not, that, um, that they are afraid of their kids ask them for help. Um, there is the case of this mom, uh, from the twin cities who gave me a call about our daughter, um, running away and leaving with the wrong people at 19 or 20. But when I talked to her more to see what caused that, um, and I'll dig in her conversation inside, she told me, uh, uh, last three, four years, she was asking to see a mental health doctor.
Speaker 1 00:38:24 She says she has issues. She's hearing voices. Uh, she, uh, it has gotten worse, but it started easy symptoms. Um, but the mom said, when I asked her, why don't you help her out talk to her doctor? I set up an appointment. She said she was afraid of for her neighbors and everyone saying that her daughter, her daughter is crazy or, or all on tight. Uh, she has a mental health and she didn't want that shaming around her community. What can we do doctor on, um, colleagues of this research? What can we do to educate our parents, your parents, or as parents, or the first generation or second generation or those families that really would like to be educated? What can we do? I'll start with Dr. Salem citizens. It's a little bit of a difficult question.
Speaker 2 00:39:17 Well, I think that what they're doing today is we'll be kind of starting with, we can start talking openly about, uh, what, you know, mental health and psychological wellness. I actually call it wellness, not the illness, uh, what there is money. Um, when a young person is asking for help, that is the time to get the help for them. Because actually the more I said, we don't give that help. The worst that they may get worse. And so if somebody will say that his, uh, you know, <inaudible>, if a young person is depressed and they come and they said, you know, I need to see a therapy stories and you'd see a psychiatrist, or even talk to their primary care to that medication. And we help with them. It may be, we may be able to manage the depression and they may just gone and do well.
Speaker 2 00:40:07 But the more we delay services and help the worst things can get much worse. I think that, um, we, as a community have to do more of this. We have to talk about number one, that we are a unit, the things that our kids are going through, even if you took away, the war are high. Now, there is a high, young people are experiencing very high levels of psychological distress, including like I work in a university, including the students at the university. You know, there's a lot, the difference between many other youth and ours is that hours. As you said, often, don't feel, um, encouraged to talk about it or help. So what really need is to do what we are doing. We also need to increase the therapist is in our community. We need to increase the people who are able. I know a lot of young people who want to see a therapist for example, but they feel they're not then a therapist who speak theory or who understand their culture.
Speaker 2 00:41:05 It's not the learn about language who understand your culture. And also for pat, we have to do intervention. It's much easier if a young kid, um, you know, I, I know parents are terrified of getting help for their year old, but it's much better to get help for 13 year old than to wait until they're 18. Again, if you intervene, the more we become the thing, not thinking about, I know I've worked a lot with somebody's parents, and I know what they will say is it's end of the world. If my child gets psychiatric supports because my child will never have future, they will never go to college. They will never, for any parent who is listening to me and to anyone who talks to patents, if a child is struggling and we don't help with them, the thing you most, which is that your future will be impacted by this experience, it's more likely to happen. If you don't get help, if you put like when they're younger and you're stress, as soon as it starts struggling to get the support they need at this moment, give them a much greater chance to reach those life goals. So I will let them Sophia, Sophia and saying, yeah,
Speaker 1 00:42:12 Before I get to saying about Sophia and Sophia, let's hear this couple of messages and we'll be right back. Thank you. Welcome back. This is a jury SAC B from Somali link radio. I also want to thank every show that most wonderful ladies here who produced the show, Annie and Amina call DECA. Uh, thank you ladies for making this show. Yes. Um, uh, if you're just joining us almost about, you know, 15 minutes to our show, up to 45 minutes to our show, and we've got another 15 minutes left. I am talking to, um, Dr. <inaudible>, who's a professor in the school of social work and under the mentor of the rest of the guests who are students and, um, well, not almost everybody is right now. Sophia Ali sophomore at the university of Minnesota, twin cities is studying sociology and may other guests is Sophia Muhammad, uh, another sophomore at St.
Speaker 1 00:43:26 Thomas studying journalism. And also saying I met recent graduate with a degree in biology has done a research with Dr. C E the Abdi. Who's a professor in the school of social work and, um, an, a mentor to these young ladies on his students. And they've done study on trauma in the Somali community and how the flux is. People are now learning about the study. So us, we were, uh, talking to a doctor outside the set as there. My question now, uh, Sophia, um, what can we do Sophia as a fear and Azalea, what can we do to educate our community? How can we fight? Is stigma on trauma or stress or mental health is to educate your parents and their parents and the adults like me in the community, the fathers, what can, what can we do? Um, what's your take?
Speaker 4 00:44:32 Yeah. Um, I saw, I just wanted to say that it's easy to place blame, um, uh, on our parents for the trauma that they have passed out. But, um, for me, especially, it's really important to understand that our parents themselves are shouldering their own trauma trauma. They don't know about trauma, that they have not unpacked. And, um, yeah. And so I feel like that's why it's so important that although it is amazing to have these conversations with the youth, it needs to branch onto parents and family members, because even just looking at the youth swell being, if they are, um, healing from their trauma, they need to have a healthy support and healthy relationships around them. So if, for example, if the stigma that we know, uh, continues to exist, we hit a wall because they won't have a thriving environment for them to heal in. Um, so carrying on these conversations and, um, continuing to talk, uh, with family members and not just youth, uh, yeah. Okay. Sophia.
Speaker 5 00:45:57 Yes. I think one thing that we can do moving forward is for young people to interact with each other more empathetically. I think it's important to understand that everyone is going through something and, um, we're all just collectively shouldering our own traumas in our own, uh, negative experiences. And it's important that we keep that in mind, we're interacting with one another and through interacting empathetically, we can, um, take a step forward and create spaces where we can open up to each other and do the work that we're doing with Jose, that, which is, uh, talking about it and discussing it and making sure that everyone's story is heard and validated.
Speaker 1 00:46:49 Thank you. Um, Sophia say numb,
Speaker 4 00:46:54 Sophia. Um, I just wanted to agree with what both with what everybody said, and I want to also emphasize that there are resources. Um, I mean, for us specifically, we live in Minnesota and since there is such a big, you know, Somali population here, there are Somali therapists, there are Somali, um, mental health specialists. There are people like <inaudible> who are, you know, trained subsidy. There's I believe a social worker. There are people who you can reach out to for help, who are, who are understanding of our own experiences in our community. And to take advantage of that. I know a lot of parents who are afraid of, you know, the, the culture, the culture gap, and the language barrier between themselves and other therapists, and they might be skeptical taking their kids there for those reasons, but there are, there are resources within our community that you can take advantage of.
Speaker 1 00:47:44 Thank you. Um, Dr. Saying in the research you identified with the students, are your identified some cultural healing practices. What did you all find found out, or what did you find out? Um, what kind of practices what's your so useful, um, cultural practices in our community?
Speaker 2 00:48:06 Well, you know, psychological world, first of all, um, again, you know, I really agree with everything. Um, that's a fear Sophia Zane have upset and, you know, fact that we, I personally know, uh, clinicians or Somali, we need to always increase and specifically increase them in the hospitals and school system is to have us, you know, people who can communicate with parents and children. And I love the idea of, I agree with them, uh, of, of, uh, the fact that we have to take two prong where we actually talk to you, talk to patterns and talk to them together, bring them together. Um, and you know, we were going to be, uh, these young ladies who have their own children. So we talking about the fourth generation, you know, it's the unfortunate relation of somebody here and how are we going? The healing we do now is going to be biased at all.
Speaker 2 00:48:59 Um, so two to three of the go back about what you said about indigenous indigenous healing and healing practices. Um, some of these are about relationships and the, the, the most, the greatest healing that exists is actually is what Sophia said, empathy connection. Uh, when we do therapy, we say, uh, the trauma healing is about relationships and connection. Only after you've done those things. Can you actually start teaching people how to, and safety, safety, and relationships and connection after you've done those two things, can you start, then you can start teaching people, uh, what we call a self-immolation, so how to breathe and how to sort of recognize their triggers. But if you don't have a safe environment, and if you don't have relationships that are strong, uh, we cannot heal. And in our culture, uh, I know there's, you know, this in Somalia, we didn't have the amount of psychological distress we have here.
Speaker 2 00:50:06 Yes. We grew up in a very harsh environment. And one of the reasons is that we have such a strong social support. Um, you know, uh, we never had, like, I grew up in Somalia. I, we didn't have a young woman with five kids that is locked in an apartment, a two bedroom apartment all, all week by herself with no one to go to, no one to talk to part of her healing was supporting each other, talking to your aunt, talking to your cousin, having that communal connection. And so in one way, we can actually start bringing our mentors and bringing support systems, strengthening those support systems in our community, sort of recreating those connections. Even though my aunt may not be here, there are other Somali or the answer Sofia sides are so busy that may not be, are there other Somali woman who can actually step up to that role and sorta of, uh, feel that role?
Speaker 2 00:51:07 Another thing is also that how we change be intergenerational. You know, one of the things we, uh, I learned how to pattern from my mom, but reality is that now the way I patented as a mother is different because here it's different because I, I deal with different things, right? So actually again, you know, helping patterns is build all these trends of what we all have, the hat, which is bolting each other learning no one, one of the things that frustrates me is that no one, as much as Somalis, all the cultures, that the acculturation of intergenerational challenges are not only about Somalis, all immigrant communities and one of the things, no one ever actually does patenting because in our culture, often, if you say to someone I'm going to teach you parenting skills, they will think like, I know how to pattern, which they do, but not in the context of maybe in this culture.
Speaker 2 00:52:00 And again, you know, values such as, you know, the hill, <inaudible> the things I was talking about, like hair, which was referred to like this idea of restorative practice, going back to our community. When we have conflicts in the family, how did we resolve it by having community elders ISTEP in, we may have that structured now, but we can actually recreate some of those practices. So actually going back to the things that have made us healthy communities, uh, before we migrated adopting them for here, because I know that we cannot just, you know, translate those to here. That actually can be more of a problem that is a region, but adapting them for this context. Uh, but we cannot disregard everything we ever had and we cannot transport everything we ever had. You have to find some way of creating a feeling between the reality we live in and the values we hold, so we can create healthy environments for our children. Thank
Speaker 1 00:52:59 You saying that. Um, one last question for all of you starting with Dr. Cena, um, for example, say if our first generation came here with all the trauma, I mean the biggest trauma ever, um, from the civil war, from being in refugee camps, uh, being, you know, distressed, uh, in every direction you look at, uh, coming into new culture with their children, um, a new life, a new world, um, of where, where those parents had cultural and language barrier, where as one elder said, if, if in America, even if you want to say hello to someone, you have to sign a paper, um, that bureaucratic world where those first generation didn't have the, mostly the language and cultural skills. Um, of course, that they were traumatized in many ways. Is it possible that they naturally transfer or impact those trauma? Some of it on the kids and the kids when they grow up, not impacting professionally that or a culturally specific way, then they continue to do that into the next generation. Is that something possible
Speaker 2 00:54:20 That, that concerned him? I, the short answer is that the into what's called first of all, you know, I really want to, because I know we have only two minutes to live with that. I will never ever talk about our community. Only ask the community to have a deficit. We are a big strength. I always say there is no stronger person than a refugee mom who was able to bring her children here, despite everything she went to. So, but yes, there is a whole research field or intergenerational trauma, which is how we pass along. And this can be, you have seen this with what has happened to indigenous communities. It can take a long time and it can go, you know, from generation to generation to generation. And that's really one of the reasons we need healing. I really want each of these students to have the last word, so I will stop there. The short answer is yes. Thank you. That would be past
Speaker 1 00:55:13 One minute, 20 seconds each person, uh, I'll start with Sophia.
Speaker 4 00:55:18 Um, yeah, I agree. I think that everyone needs to heal from their traumas, that the next generation will be safe. Go ahead. Sophia.
Speaker 5 00:55:31 I also agree. I think it's more than high time that we break the cycle and begin a new cycle of healing,
Speaker 1 00:55:40 Uh, say numb the last word.
Speaker 4 00:55:43 Yes. Um, so I agree also, um, I feel like, um, when looking at our parents and thinking about our own trauma that has been passed down, um, they have not been able to unpack it, whereas we.
